I get letters from self-professed Nice Guys, complaining that women must WANT to be treated like shit, because THEY, the “Nice Guy” have failed repeatedly in relationships. –Heartless Bitches International
This has been written about in the feminist blogosphere time and time again and hardly requires a post from me. However, I’ve just experienced a conversation so excruciatingly tedious from a bemoaning young man that it warrants a diatribe. Early this morning at a cafe, he thought it appropriate to interrogate me for personal information, and, upon my polite declination of his advances, engaged in such miserable self-deprecation that I mustered all obtainable resistance from swiftly kicking him in the shins. As I continued to pointedly read my book, he complained that he should have known not to try, because “beautiful women” never go out with “nice guys” like him, and he then proceeded to list superficially “deep” attributes that he believed entitled him to my number, as if I’m supposed to give a fuck.
On verge of murder, I deliberated whether it was best to retain a steely boiling silence or ceremoniously throw my coffee up his nose. He was of course passively manipulative, hoping to shame me into submission by evoking sympathy. Masquerading manipulation as desirability to engender a potentially sexual relationship is a pattern consistent with both abhorrent Nice Guys and the assholes from whom they claim to differ. This is because they are the same asshole, the only distinction being Nice Guys incorporate themselves into the “nice guy” category to champion the delusion that “women don’t like nice guys”, conveniently avoiding any unpleasant realization that they themselves are assholes: petulant, passive aggressive, and manipulative. In their thinly veiled true arrogance they expect a woman to sleep with them for “being nice” the criteria of which includes but is not limited to opening doors, pulling out chairs, paying for dinner, other shit you never asked for, and not forgetting your birthday.
Furthermore, their entire show of self-pitying broodiness to buy sympathy is an abominable impersonation of earnest gesture, thereby a violation of integrity, disguising their malignant intentions. Abusive relationships very often involve emotional blackmail of a similar nature, the height of which is suicide threats. This is so poorly executed that upon the very first encounter I was well aware of these pathetic inequities: the entitlement is apparent in that “women don’t like nice guys” really means “beautiful women” (as though beautiful women owe them something and as though only beautiful women are really women) and such militant commiseration would never be extended to conventionally unattractive women, who would instead be told sneeringly to lose some weight and “what the fuck, you’re not entitled to a date.”
Of course, he only pursues beautiful women precisely because he would wish to only associate himself with beautiful women: your looks are his status.
Nice Guys predictably whine about how they’re told off by women “who aren’t even pretty enough to act bitchy”, as if they’re the fucking ego police and the world is concerned with their irrelevant measurements.
And then they judge the men with whom women are in relationships, as though they know or it’s any of their businesses.
Likewise the unthinkable conceit is embedded into the presumptions of the very framework of approach, which I won’t bother write about here, since I’ve done so already.
I never considered myself a beautiful woman, but on the event that I am, the presentation of generic contemplations that men believe to be original and insightful (“The universe is such a big place!”) is unimpressively parallel to “I own a boat.” I suppose that sitting there, with my hair in beach waves and a flowing skirt that gripped my waist and a blouse I had discovered later had inadvertently unbuttoned at the top, I might have looked beautiful. This would provide my bitchy advice with some credibility*; of course, Nice Guy still prefers I shut up and sit quietly on my pedestal where I won’t have the audacity to be human, and will ideally act as a silent muse while he does important manly things like contribute to civilization.
*I am mocking you.
Related: Shakesville on Nice Guys
the fatal feminist 
I knew several guys in college who suffered from the Nice Guy syndrome something terrible. At one point, I got so annoyed with listening to them talk about ‘the Friend Zone’ that I pointed out to them that girls have a friend zone, too – it’s called ‘being unattractive.’ It was a surprisingly effective technique, as they never lectured me about the Friend Zone ever again!
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Ugh, God I HATE the lectures about imaginary friend zones. I’ve only had three crushes in my entire life, and with EVERY ONE of them we had established a meaningful foundation of friendship first. Hilariously, the same people simultaneously contend that men and women are incapable of being ‘just friends.’
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Yeah, I have never understood why there should be a distinction – I only want to date people I’ve been friends with first. (I also really don’t understand dating in the more traditional sense – why would I want to go to dinner with someone I just met? Wouldn’t that be incredibly awkward?)
Apropos of nothing – is it snowing on wordpress? Wow, that confused me – I thought my screen was freaking out!
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Ahaha yes! If you go to ‘general settings’ and check ‘Show falling snow on my blog until January 4th.’ it snows!
As I live in California, this is exciting.
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I don’t get these so-called “nice guys” either. When they bemoan the fact that women only want to date “jerks” they never actually define what makes a guy a “jerk.” I also noticed something else about these “nice guys.” A lot of them seem to buy into the whole PUA philosophy, because apparently women aren’t individuals to them, we’re these mythical species that need to be “figured out.” To make it worse, they seem to believe that women want to be treated like crap. In reality, these “nice guys” are just closet misogynists and they haven’t figured out that women don’t want to be with a guy who hates them.
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Uggh. Sorry you had to deal with that jackass.
Nice Guys™ always make me think of the Sleater-Kinney song “Little Babies”: “All the little babies go oh oh I want to”
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“Nice” guys are masters at making us feel responsible for their feelings.
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Great post, Nahida, and I’m sending my sympathies and best wishes to you through cyber space ;)… UGH! I’ve never met an actually “nice” guy who referred to himself as a “nice guy”, but exactly the different versions of a whole team of whiny, self-centred, entitlement-driven sexists you describe here. I am a person, though – not a randomly numbered “female” that (not who…) can be shamed into finally getting you laid – too bad that basic fact is lost on some people…
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but you are beautiful.
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<3!
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I’ve been writing a series about Nice Guys(tm) over at my blog, actually. My commenters have been… well, kind of obnoxious. Several of them have theorized that the core problem is women taking advantage of perfectly nice young men by being friends with them and not giving them sex in return… *sigh* Not to mention that apparently not calling a guy after a first date is the worst sin anyone has ever committed ever.
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taking advantage of perfectly nice young men by being friends with them and not giving them sex in return…
LOLOL classic!
In exchange for my friendship I demand sexx!! Wha..? You don’t think being a friend entitles me to sex? You think YOUR friendship is already the equivalent of MY friendship?? You biiiitch!
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Excuse me if this is out of place, but I feel the inclination to rant at your Nice Guy.
As I continued to pointedly read my book, he complained that he should have known not to try, because “beautiful women” never go out with “nice guys” like him
Me: “You’re not nice. You’re a manipulative, passive-aggressive, entitled, boundary-ignoring and inconsiderate asshole. My physical attractiveness does not obligate me to accept your attentions, and it certainly does not obligate me to make up for your failures with other women, and I don’t know how you expect to be successful in the first place when you treat me like the world is your girlfriend grocery store. Newsflash for you, you’re not the only human being in the equation—when you obviously don’t care whether she’d rather be focusing on something else, when you annoy her, when you don’t even make any effort to be an interesting person to know, why the hell would she want to spend time with you? And if you won’t respect her disinterest with good grace, if you disdain the concept that she knows better than you do what SHE wants in a relationship, if you refuse to accept that sometimes she’s just not going to be interested in you, because humans are individuals with different tastes and sometimes you’re just not interchangeable with her heart’s desire, then why the hell would she want someone like you in her life? Dude, you’re not failing because beautiful women are shallow bitches, you’re failing because you have an ugliness of character that goes down DEEP.”
Thank you, I feel better now.
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Wow, your “arguments” suck dude. You’re just quoting what she says and making a completely irrelevant statement.
You’re not “educating” anyone here. Get a life.
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Troll who thinks he can define what feminism is better than women has been banned after more essays.
Amusing fact: And he continued to attempt a few more times under different names (as if that would get him around the ban) because as a man he is entitled (entitled!) to coming into any space he pleases and forcing the audience to entertain his shitty opinions in hopes that we would fawn over them.
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You know you’re dealing with privilege when ‘involuntary celibacy’ is a serious diagnosis.
The entitlement to sex you talked about in your post is spot-on.
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LOL INCEL? INVOLUNTARY CELIBACY is something men SUFFER FROM when they can’t have sex with women?
I kind of understand though. I haven’t been on a roller coaster in 2 years and I’m suffering inrol because of it.
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Wait, so I don’t have an entitlement to sex? No wonder people give me such strange looks for demanding it. Now i think I owe that old woman at the Target an apology . . .
(/snark)
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Men have very strong sexual needs! Women do not! So men must approach women for sex! Nature decided it! When a man tries to be a kind and courteous gentleman in approaching women, the ladies very often take it as a sign of weakness and unattractiveness! Genuine nice guys know this well! Genuine nice guys wish to be sensitive and caring! They typically try to place a woman’s needs above their own! Yet, genuine nice guys are faulted for eventually wanting to have their needs met! A woman who tells a grown man that she only likes him as a friend, is not a real friend at all! If she know the man is without a woman, she would be a woman for him or help him to find someone! That would be a real friend! If she does neither, she is WORTHLESS!
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Why are you so excited!
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Poe’s law! I’m confused!
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I thought it was satire too until around the middle.
tldr; if you don’t have sex with him you’re worthless.
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Classic ‘Nice Guy” TM. Convinced he’s a “genuine nice guy” all the while spouting vile misogynistic crap.
“A woman who tells a grown man that she only likes him as a friend, is not a real friend at all! If she know the man is without a woman, she would be a woman for him or help him to find someone!.”
Yes because if she were a true friend she would suck your dick, right?
Seriously, dude you are without a woman because you are an asshole. Any woman who is friends with you is going to see that. (although I doubt you have any female friends)It’s not a woman’s job to find you someone either. Nor are they obligated to pity-fuck you.
How do men like you exist? Convinced you are “nice” yet you’re saying women are only just walking sex holes?
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